tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7202906.post9076462280223787714..comments2024-02-18T19:36:43.844+11:00Comments on theatre notes: A divagationAlison Croggonhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/08398213223487458758noreply@blogger.comBlogger28125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7202906.post-1281015600316837392011-06-24T00:48:59.603+10:002011-06-24T00:48:59.603+10:00Neandellus:
"fifth century athens had about 3...Neandellus:<br />"fifth century athens had about 30000 citizens. Yr average Balinese village through the late 1800s had less than a hundred. A town doesn't need to be New York to create morally profound and aesthetically pure theatre."<br /><br />Absolutely. I'm not talking about cultural vitality as a whole, I'm talking about mainstage theatre, where simple economics will Casey Bennettohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00069992763893159912noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7202906.post-38190627138542311142011-06-21T14:25:54.286+10:002011-06-21T14:25:54.286+10:00A good single malt is actually my favourite tipple...A good single malt is actually my favourite tipple.<br /><br />"To find a form that accommodates the mess, that is the task of the artist now..." Sam Beckett.<br /><br />"At the School of Visual Arts in New York, you can get your degree in Net art, which is really a fantastic way of thinking of theatre in new ways...." Laurie AndersonZanenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7202906.post-10657228516642030532011-06-21T12:36:07.577+10:002011-06-21T12:36:07.577+10:00I like beer. Zane likes wine. Alison drinks port. ...I like beer. Zane likes wine. Alison drinks port. Casey enjoys gin. I think port is too sweet. Zane thinks everything is crap if it's not wine. Casey doesn't think we do gin well here, but he likes good gin from other places. Alsion thinks we drink too much beer and we need to expand our taste in drinks. The quality of the drink is not determined by the 'vessel' but the quality ofBorbsnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7202906.post-65354328770667273012011-06-21T09:29:55.487+10:002011-06-21T09:29:55.487+10:00"thus many plays are be spoken about as if th..."thus many plays are be spoken about as if they are just vessels into which "content" can be poured. And that's the black hole, I think."..yes, exactly, spot on.Zanenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7202906.post-83770228863897689522011-06-21T09:09:48.695+10:002011-06-21T09:09:48.695+10:00A bigger population can guarantee more money and a...A bigger population can guarantee more money and allow marginal activities a larger critical mass, which can be critical. But I agree, it's no measure of cultural vitality. Small can be an advantage: it's a truism that festivals work better in small cities, because of the intensity of focus that makes possible. That can be true of other things. But really, it's the measure of our Alison Croggonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08398213223487458758noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7202906.post-91800164113629131992011-06-20T21:21:39.101+10:002011-06-20T21:21:39.101+10:00"We don't have the population to sustain ..."We don't have the population to sustain anything else, in the absence of real artistic discipline and a sustained flurry of arts funding."<br /><br />Argh. We have *got* to stop blaming the size of the population.<br /><br />I don't want to go confusing a rake with a rickshaw (how infectious), but fifth century athens had about 30000 citizens. Yr average Balinese village Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7202906.post-89393549491917922072011-06-20T20:41:57.799+10:002011-06-20T20:41:57.799+10:00Did you see Yael's performance in the Ralph My...Did you see Yael's performance in the Ralph Myers/Lally Katz production of <i>Frankenstein</i> a couple of years ago, John? A lot of pathos-effect clowning there, too.Matthewhttp://www.matthewclayfield.com/noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7202906.post-74957523899066113032011-06-20T17:06:10.696+10:002011-06-20T17:06:10.696+10:00Hmm. I agree and disagree here John, but I don'...Hmm. I agree and disagree here John, but I don't really want to discuss TJOT until I've had a chance to talk about it properly... ie, I think there's lots to discuss, and it seems a little unfair (of me, not of you) to take little nips at it before a more articulated response. In this case, I'd say the frame is (or at least, begins with) farce. <br /><br />In any case, it's Alison Croggonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08398213223487458758noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7202906.post-71147097033945718762011-06-20T16:07:57.791+10:002011-06-20T16:07:57.791+10:00...and I'm with Casey:
"I'm actually......and I'm with Casey:<br /><br />"I'm actually quite a fan of naturalism (as unfashionable as that is), but the notion that Australian mainstage theatre is overly devoted to it is fanciful."<br /><br />I don't think naturalism (or realism) are necessarily pertinent here. The meaning of a particular performance style grows in part from the generic frame audiences put around Born Dancin'https://www.blogger.com/profile/14526760383290674186noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7202906.post-9648231914143653392011-06-20T15:23:16.621+10:002011-06-20T15:23:16.621+10:00My whole life is procrastination, Zane. I rather s...My whole life is procrastination, Zane. I rather suspect if it were not for procrastination, I would get nothing done at all...<br /><br />Hi Casey - I've no objection to naturalism either: it's a powerful form, which is maybe why it's not done that much. (I strongly agree that we don't see much of it). And it's hard to argue with what you say about sitcoms and the mugging forAlison Croggonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08398213223487458758noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7202906.post-57146785428241859022011-06-20T14:59:29.568+10:002011-06-20T14:59:29.568+10:00I'm with Cameron on this one. I've lost tr...I'm with Cameron on this one. I've lost track of how many times recently I've seen characters, momentum and any sense of a broader shape trampled underfoot in the stampede towards a cheap laugh. It betrays a fundamental insecurity on the part of the practitioners - "better grab the little reward now, we may not get the big one later" - which is not only self-fulfilling but Casey Bennettohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00069992763893159912noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7202906.post-80824147047666281982011-06-20T13:05:11.025+10:002011-06-20T13:05:11.025+10:00OK then, ta, I'll await your reviews written h...OK then, ta, I'll await your reviews written here as creative procrastination about all the other things you have to do.Zanenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7202906.post-66945352336283797062011-06-20T12:12:08.803+10:002011-06-20T12:12:08.803+10:00I know what you mean, Cameron, although on this it...I know what you mean, Cameron, although on this it's difficult to talk in generalities. Ie, if I knew which shows you meant, I may well agree with you. <br /><br />Yes, A GOLEM STORY is definitely interesting. And is one of the six shows I'm hoping I can write about this week. There's been a rash of interesting work, and I'm finding myself woefully behind. But this week I am Alison Croggonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08398213223487458758noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7202906.post-16768138793414810222011-06-20T12:02:06.083+10:002011-06-20T12:02:06.083+10:00Al, have you nseen Golem and is it any good? It lo...Al, have you nseen Golem and is it any good? It looks real interesting from afar?Zanenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7202906.post-26120997650965509482011-06-20T10:39:12.049+10:002011-06-20T10:39:12.049+10:00It isn't the clowning or 'vulgar demotics&...It isn't the clowning or 'vulgar demotics' per se. It's the unedifying way those techniques are often used in Australian theatre - ie. usually to reduce complexity and reach for a cheap laugh instead. (Because, bugger it, audiences are way too dense to appreciate complexity ...)Cameron Woodheadhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09066457450822137744noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7202906.post-15377809893173832672011-06-20T10:23:36.749+10:002011-06-20T10:23:36.749+10:00I wasn't being patronising. Just wondering if,...I wasn't being patronising. Just wondering if, say, you misunderstand clowning or other vulgar demotics of performance as coarseness. (Which, of course, they are, in a certain sense.) You've lost me on the vegemite sandwiches.Alison Croggonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08398213223487458758noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7202906.post-20450170977473842292011-06-20T10:01:39.093+10:002011-06-20T10:01:39.093+10:00Don't patronise me. I know a hawk from a hands...Don't patronise me. I know a hawk from a handsaw as far as traditions of performance go.<br /><br />Let's just say that if you're making vegemite sandwiches out of quote naturalism unquote, you're unlikely to fare better with any of the reactions to it - all of which contain traces of the thing they're reacting to (how could they not).Cameron Woodheadhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09066457450822137744noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7202906.post-90070395859406658682011-06-20T08:47:27.325+10:002011-06-20T08:47:27.325+10:00Thanks, Zane.
Cameron, I'm not sure what you...Thanks, Zane. <br /><br />Cameron, I'm not sure what you mean by "coarse, shouty" acting. Or I'm wondering if you're reading as coarse and shouty some of those stylised performance traditions we've been talking about in this thread...Alison Croggonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08398213223487458758noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7202906.post-91698676196488684082011-06-20T06:18:23.442+10:002011-06-20T06:18:23.442+10:00It isn't the writing, it's the direction. ...It isn't the writing, it's the direction. Think of all the coarse, shouty acting you've seen at the MTC over the years. That lack of emotional intelligence, to me, is much scarier than any putative anti-intellectual bias in the culture ... though that's scary too.Cameron Woodheadhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09066457450822137744noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7202906.post-6439061652535040872011-06-19T13:43:22.858+10:002011-06-19T13:43:22.858+10:00Yes, but blankets are handy in the cold, and the s...Yes, but blankets are handy in the cold, and the simplest things are always the most complicated. Maybe a few Board of Governance members who were "informed, unabashed, curious and critical" might help? Certainly the equivalent of the Christian lobby holds sway in shaping public opinion on Australian art in general; and exceptions, as they say, often prove the rule. You are about to getZanenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7202906.post-57903152024304618472011-06-19T10:34:08.483+10:002011-06-19T10:34:08.483+10:00Thanks for the debate, Zane and Borbs...
As an as...Thanks for the debate, Zane and Borbs...<br /><br />As an aside... I mentioned commedia merely as one example of an obvious tradition deeply embedded in Australian performance - it was an important influence on the physical performance of the APG, via some workshops run by George Ogilvy at the early MTC, which knowledge itself came from his study in Paris with Jacques Lecoq. (Sometimes in the 80sAlison Croggonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08398213223487458758noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7202906.post-56696891326764966572011-06-18T20:09:38.526+10:002011-06-18T20:09:38.526+10:00Good points Zane; I agree that the arts are underf...Good points Zane; I agree that the arts are underfunded (Arts Victoria bureaucrats making dodgy under-the-table deals with office supply companies doesn't help, politically speaking :)<br /><br />My objection was to your statement (tongue in cheek as it may be) that schools and parents are to blame. After reading your post, you seem to think that funding is to blame. I would rather blame it Borbsnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7202906.post-91434906942639150642011-06-18T19:25:53.873+10:002011-06-18T19:25:53.873+10:00I dunno why we are fixated on Commedia? I mean, is...I dunno why we are fixated on Commedia? I mean, is that the problem? That when we say 100s of years of none literary theatre the best we can think is Commedia (and bit of circus)?. I'm sorry but I find Commedia boring as all get out as well Borb, and yes you are very lucky to live in Victoria, and yes I've heard of the Malthouse, and yes I've been to festivals, even fringe ones...andZanehttp://zanetrow.net/noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7202906.post-58699309607817898922011-06-18T11:42:18.803+10:002011-06-18T11:42:18.803+10:00I disagree with you Zane: I am a drama educator an...I disagree with you Zane: I am a drama educator and the entire curriculum in Victorian schools is geared almost exclusively to the study and practice of non-naturalism. Post secondary – the VCA is geared almost exclusively to non-naturalistic explorations of theatrical text. You will be hard pressed to find a drama student in Victoria who hasn't studied and explored Commedia, mime, physical Borbsnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7202906.post-8658078115047041802011-06-18T10:47:03.332+10:002011-06-18T10:47:03.332+10:00Hi Alison...if commedia & circus have a hold o...Hi Alison...if commedia & circus have a hold on Australian theatre I haven't noticed it...actors walk on stage and talk to each other as far as I can see....I think Australia is very very good at text...I don't know anything about Australian poetry, but I think Australia writes awful plays...where actors walk on stage and talk to each other...endlessly. All those lovely resources, Zanehttp://zanetrow.net/noreply@blogger.com