tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7202906.post8827318106906917015..comments2024-02-18T19:36:43.844+11:00Comments on theatre notes: The dark art of the slagAlison Croggonhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/08398213223487458758noreply@blogger.comBlogger23125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7202906.post-33273737064760578842012-02-20T12:48:08.059+11:002012-02-20T12:48:08.059+11:00"However, and I ask everyone in the room: why..."However, and I ask everyone in the room: why don't we get worked up more often about unsubstantiated positive reviews, that make up (by bulk, although possibly not by readership) the majority of what goes under theatre reviewing in Australia?"<br /><br />Thank you Jana. In Sydney this is a particular problem in the mainstream press and could go som way to explain the ugly rise of Jono Blacknoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7202906.post-28447441383302611292012-02-20T01:31:24.386+11:002012-02-20T01:31:24.386+11:00Thankfully, Cameron did not stick to his new year ...Thankfully, Cameron did not stick to his new year resolution - the one where he vowed to comment less on Alison's blog- Please continue, both of you, because without your discourse (and its wonderful passion!) theatre in Melbourne is indeed left, overwhelming, though not exclusively- to trolls of a kind.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7202906.post-583776933666463832012-02-19T18:01:13.885+11:002012-02-19T18:01:13.885+11:00JS's most recent reviews - of Thyestes in part...JS's most recent reviews - of Thyestes in particular - suggest a forthrightness on the wane. Different can of worms when you're "out", perhaps.<br /><br />And I quote:<br /><br />"I know you’ve all been anxiously waiting for this review and I can’t blame you. Did she love it? Did she hate it? How will she respond to 'Thyestes'? Will she rip it a new one or has she Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7202906.post-43252051727811384672012-02-19T12:15:10.711+11:002012-02-19T12:15:10.711+11:00Sure, unsubstantiated positive reviews are as bad ...Sure, unsubstantiated positive reviews are as bad as unsubstantiated negative ones. And they're much, much more common online than in print. I was planning on linking to the funniest and most incompetent examples at some point.<br /><br />Helen saw theatre for decades and usually gave her reasons. Her reviews weren't 'unsubstantiated'. Jana might have regularly disagreed with themCameron Woodheadhttp://cameronwoodhead.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7202906.post-4022811586648474282012-02-19T09:00:42.599+11:002012-02-19T09:00:42.599+11:00I guess the key thing is "unsubtantiated"...I guess the key thing is "unsubtantiated" criticism. That drives me crazy, in print or pixels. <br /><br />If there <i>is</i> "critic bashing" (and I don't think Jana is doing that, any more than I thought you were, or at least, I hope not), it's only of concern if it reinforces the tendency in our culture that is hostile to the whole idea of questioning conventional Alison Croggonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08398213223487458758noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7202906.post-84620331066484746922012-02-19T03:51:21.074+11:002012-02-19T03:51:21.074+11:00Oh come on Jana. I disagreed with some of Helen...Oh come on Jana. I disagreed with some of Helen's reviews (and sane, intelligent people do disagree about art) but she was fearless about what she didn't like. <br /><br />Fact is, we don't support our best critics here. Quite the opposite. We have predictable panels titled 'Critical Failure' and such. Critic-bashing is ubiquitous. You're doing it now.<br /><br />If we Cameron Woodheadhttp://cameronwoodhead.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7202906.post-23814100902317024432012-02-19T01:00:10.272+11:002012-02-19T01:00:10.272+11:00Certainly it's time to put to bed the print/bl...Certainly it's time to put to bed the print/blog dichotomy, isn't it? Except to point out, time and again, that bloggers aren't paid for updating their blogs.<br /><br />However, and I ask everyone in the room: why don't we get worked up more often about unsubstantiated <i>positive</i> reviews, that make up (by bulk, although possibly not by readership) the majority of what goes Janahttp://guerrillasemiotics.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7202906.post-12552516369915295772012-02-18T17:36:15.156+11:002012-02-18T17:36:15.156+11:00I'm not sure my tune has changed so much as th...I'm not sure my tune has changed so much as the melody and harmony have swapped places. I still think the internet is full of trolls! Focusing on them at the expense of informed online commentators isn't productive though.<br /><br />And I have no problem with people having a go at print critics, as long as the criticism is specific and backed by evidence, rather than an unsubstantiated Cameron Woodheadhttp://cameronwoodhead.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7202906.post-42445877809256130582012-02-18T16:39:41.716+11:002012-02-18T16:39:41.716+11:00If I were paying $15000 a term to send my child to...If I were paying $15000 a term to send my child to St Andrews I'd like to think the teachers knew the meaning of the word "imbibe."Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01400137401500268708noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7202906.post-9491409827334703542012-02-18T16:33:38.415+11:002012-02-18T16:33:38.415+11:00Do I contradict myself? Very well then, I contradi...Do I contradict myself? Very well then, I contradict myself, (I am large, I contain multitudes...)<br /><br />Still, I'm not sure that is a fair representation of what I said, Cameron. What I said was this:<br /><br />"It may be true, as Williamson claims, that "for every brilliant new blogger that has emerged, 100 pallid yes-men (and women) have sprung up." What he doesn'tAlison Croggonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08398213223487458758noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7202906.post-9543624950681632682012-02-18T13:40:56.589+11:002012-02-18T13:40:56.589+11:00The looseness of Simmons' expression isn't...The looseness of Simmons' expression isn't only a matter of style though. I think Jana's analysis is spot on. It infects her ability to communicate her knowledge. <br /><br />In the Baal review, she seems to imagine that the play is flawed because Brecht hadn't perfected 'alienation', when it is an expressionist play. Brecht hadn't thought of Epic Theatre or the Cameron Woodheadhttp://cameronwoodhead.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7202906.post-5740294516686230722012-02-18T09:13:39.210+11:002012-02-18T09:13:39.210+11:00If I were obsessed with everyone I speak to on twi...If I were obsessed with everyone I speak to on twitter, my life would be very strange indeed. Or stranger than it is. But, you know, this is getting too personal for my liking. I'm not above a bit of light malice (as you know, Cameron) but flame wars are no fun at all.<br /><br />Yes, the writing means that I don't especially enjoy reading the blog and seems of a piece with much of the Alison Croggonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08398213223487458758noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7202906.post-21549173726501795242012-02-18T08:26:56.195+11:002012-02-18T08:26:56.195+11:00"Poor @alisoncroggon (is that her name?) She ..."Poor @alisoncroggon (is that her name?) She & her cronies are obsessed with me. Should I be paying her a PR fee? Hugs to you all. xx"<br /><br />She posted that on Twitter. <br /><br />In fact she made TWO POSTS STATING HOW OBSESSED YOU WERE WITH HER WITHIN AN HOUR. The other one has since been removed. Someone must've alerted her to the irony.obsessed with janenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7202906.post-51392402753677800662012-02-18T07:06:04.444+11:002012-02-18T07:06:04.444+11:00Surely you have a problem with Simmons' freque...Surely you have a problem with Simmons' frequent linguistic imprecisions and precarious command of syntax Alison? They bear directly on a critic's competence.Cameron Woodheadhttp://cameronwoodhead.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7202906.post-75116719435200579592012-02-18T00:25:46.668+11:002012-02-18T00:25:46.668+11:00Hi Dashiell - Just caught me before I retired. Tha...Hi Dashiell - Just caught me before I retired. Thanks for your post. (And I'll excuse your spelling mistakes if you excuse mine.) Yes, I don't know why the victimhood. The internet simply doesn't work by inclusions and exclusions: bloggers build their readers through their work - not, it must be noted, through mainstream coverage, though that can give an indie blogger a fillip - and Alison Croggonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08398213223487458758noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7202906.post-4699055872826330822012-02-17T23:56:53.765+11:002012-02-17T23:56:53.765+11:00Firstly, sorry about the spelling mistakes ...
I ...Firstly, sorry about the spelling mistakes ...<br /><br />I would also clarify that o am not suggesting that critics and bloggers, like yourself alison, are NOT passionate in your responses. You just have a more composed and analytical response to the work you see, that is all.dashiellnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7202906.post-32958283557442984682012-02-17T23:51:36.387+11:002012-02-17T23:51:36.387+11:00What frustrates me most about jane Simmons is her ...What frustrates me most about jane Simmons is her perceived victimization. She is determined to martyr herself and paint herself as a hero for the people and a victim of elitist Sydney theatre goers and the blogging mafia/posse.<br /><br />She even made a comment about you on Facebook Allison:<br /><br />Poor @alisoncroggon (is that her name?) She & her cronies are obsessed with me. Should I dashiellnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7202906.post-18730036546716651322012-02-17T09:40:33.504+11:002012-02-17T09:40:33.504+11:00Ah, now the sledging starts. Perhaps commenters sh...Ah, now the sledging starts. Perhaps commenters should read the comments policy, handily available from the menu bar. Disagreement and even passionate argument is welcome; abuse is not. Mainly because it is dull, and only serves to derail discussion.<br /><br />Mostly Jane Simmons has been an excuse to discuss what criticism is or isn't or should be, and other related questions. It doesn'Alison Croggonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08398213223487458758noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7202906.post-33761500782246326412012-02-17T09:14:39.684+11:002012-02-17T09:14:39.684+11:00Joss, that's just being silly... Simmonds won&...Joss, that's just being silly... Simmonds won't have any credibility or sway until she becomes a critic for Fairfax. Which isn't such an unimaginable prospect now that she has been given more publicity than the Global Mail article alone could have ever given her. Boo! <br /><br />As for Mr Woodhead, I'm sure he'd be happy to add to his list of recommendations the ability to Tomnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7202906.post-32789693976063831412012-02-16T22:34:29.906+11:002012-02-16T22:34:29.906+11:00Because the formula of some other critics is "...Because the formula of some other critics is "I love this show because I'm trying to get into the directors pants, I mean, next show. He's so talented and inspirational". The arse-licking incestuous love-fest that comes from others, or alternatively the uber-academic cerebral analysis doesnt draw punters or build new audiences. But I bet SOYP has/does/will.Jossnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7202906.post-9277859938556247682012-02-16T14:01:56.028+11:002012-02-16T14:01:56.028+11:00In calling Simmons 'middle-aged', I was si...In calling Simmons 'middle-aged', I was simply alerting readers to her age range. If that is taken as a sign of mumsiness (unintended by me) she can hardly complain when she makes remarks like:<br /><br />"Director Simon Stone ... tackles Brecht's early didactic play THE ONLY WAY A YOUNG MAN KNOWS HOW: blood, sex and naked bodies." (emphasis mine)<br /><br />(Worth pointing Cameron woodheadhttp://cameronwoodhead.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7202906.post-77212832069661240452012-02-16T10:30:47.216+11:002012-02-16T10:30:47.216+11:00I don't know, since I didn't write it, but...I don't know, since I didn't write it, but I suspect that Cameron wasn't so much pulling on the "mumsy" meme as alluding to the fact that most bloggers are much younger. (Aside from me, of course. I am well middle aged. And also a mother-of-three.)<br /><br />True that SOYP has positive reviews as well as negative ones. But that's what I mean about the Global Mail Alison Croggonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08398213223487458758noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7202906.post-86022133292642102532012-02-16T10:03:29.475+11:002012-02-16T10:03:29.475+11:00Sensible, apart from the fact that Woodhead gets c...Sensible, apart from the fact that Woodhead gets caught in trap of referring to her as 'middle-aged' (cue again mumsy outrage snort), is incorrect about the school (it is co-educational) and generalises that the blog has been only 'panning' directors and theatre companies when it has a fair share of positive reviews (particularly for the Griffin). <br /><br />Yes, sensible and Peter Prattlenoreply@blogger.com